▶ Coinbase Website: Coinbase.com
▶ CEX Website: cex.io
Michael Saylor joins the show for a conversation on Bitcoin, power, and the treasury company playbook. We recap 2025 and look forward at 2026 with Michael arguing that Bitcoin’s real progress shows up in institutions, credit markets, accounting rules, and bank adoption, not short term price action.
We then get into a confrontational debate on Bitcoin treasury companies, mNAV, and corporate adoption. Michael rejects the criticism outright, arguing that attacking companies buying Bitcoin misses the bigger picture and misunderstands optionality, operating leverage, and risk. We explore his vision of Bitcoin evolving from digital capital into digital credit, why credit rather than price drives power, and why focus and endurance matter more than narratives.
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CHAPTERS:
00:00:00 – Introduction
00:00:47 – Bitcoin in 2025
00:11:04 – Is The Four Year Cycle Dead
00:18:36 – ESG Collapse And AI Changing The Energy Debate
00:25:13 – Are There Too Many Treasury Companies?
00:35:39 – Bitcoin As Digital Capital Like Electricity
00:46:39 – Optionality Of Operating Companies Versus ETFs
00:54:26 – MNAV Gravity to 1
01:06:15 – Digital Credit As The Core Business Model
01:13:40 – Why Strategy Will Not Become A Bank
01:19:33 – Why Companies Fail
01:29:27 – Protocol Conservatism And Distraction Risk
01:36:35 – Why Holding USD Reserves Matters
01:42:13 – Capital Investors Versus Credit Investors
02:03:23 – Money Power And The Endless Struggle Through History
What Bitcoin Did with Danny Knowles
#Bitcoin #Finance #Money #Economics
▶ Coinbase Website: Coinbase.com
▶ CEX Website: cex.io
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